translate or leave untouched?
28 Oct 2006 12:04 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
mayoraaseiThis week's ANN rant complains of "lack of professionality" in fan translations.
As a (not very reliable) translator myself, I object to the complaints forwarded by the ranter.
The fact that fan tranlations are done in the first place to serve demands by English-speaking fans to keep up with the Japanese manga/anime progression and NOT FOR SALE OR KEEP, there is no obligation by the scanlating teams to make it in any way professional. Most translators will give the full translation of a new name or technique when it first appears. In subsequent appearances, the translator may, at their own discretion, use either the Japanese name or the English equivalent. Contrary to the claims of "language inconsistency" (i.e. not staying fully within English), there is a very practical reason for sticking with the Japanese name. Particularly with martial arts technique names, the English translations is often far longer than the Asian equivalent. Due to the language differences, the Asian equivalent is also immensely more poetic and descriptive - in Asian languages, the noun can often be substituted as a descriptor. Ice-flower-jade-lotus-soul-losing-mist (just as an example) sounds profoundly deranged in English, but actually makes sense in kanji. Similarly, translating Bleach terminlogy "fukutaichou" as "vice captain" rather than the immensely more cumbersome "assistant division commander" not only makes life easier for the editors trying to fit it into the speech bubbles (or on the screen for anime), but also for readers, who won't have to trip over titles ten words long.
Translating stuff isn't just about taking the most accurate and literal translation possible. That's what Babelfish does. Aside from considering the context, there's a need to consider what makes it most accessible and comprehensible for the readers. Stuffing the sentences full of untranslated Japanese names is not the way to go, but neither is giving a literal translation of every single Japanese word if it's going to disrupt the flow of the reading.
Moving onto honorifics, I've always been one for leaving honorifics untranslated, whether I'm translating from Chinese or Japanese. There is no equivalent for "kun" or "chan", and often not even "sama". Take "sama" for example, people refer to anyone they idolise or respect greatly as "sama" regardless of their real social status; in certain (rarer) situations, people also refer to their parents as "otou-sama" and "okaa-sama" or "chichi-ue" and "haha-ue", and using stuff like "Lord Dad" sounds less respectful than ridiculous. The honorifics of "san" and "kun" and "chan" are important in indicating the degree of familiarity. Since neither "kun" nor "chan" has an English equivalent, some translators choose to leave it off, but I feel that loses the integrity of the story - because it's these references that allow readers to discern the relationships between characters, as well as the personalities of the characters. A boy who refers to a girl he just met by first name + "chan" is most likely easy-going and playful, possibly flirtatious; whereas another boy who has known the same girl for a long time and still refers to her by last name + "san" is likely to be one who adheres to rules of courtesy or prefers to remain a distance. There is also a practice of dropping the use of "san" between students - because translating to "Mr" and "Miss" is just weird in a primary school setting - but again, the integrity is lost, because in Japanese the removal of the honorific means either familiarity or immense antagonism.
If I had to choose between a translation that translated all the "san" to "Mr/Mrs/Miss" and the "sama" to "Lord" and the "kun" and "chan" dropped, and another that left them untouched, I would without hesitation go for the latter.
I'm not sure what the ranter's standards of professionality is, anyway, as "professional" (published) translators of foreign languages are allowed a certain leeway with their material. There are several different translations of Tales of Genji: written in its old-Japanese form, it did not refer to anyone by name, but rather by their association or their rank. This was an arduous reading task for any culture not used to things written in this form, and some translators took the liberty of changing the implicit references to explicit names, while others left them intact. Does this make either of them less professional? No. They just have a different interpretation of the material - some valuing accuracy above practicality and vice versa. It is exactly the same in the fan circles.
The only valid complaint is that new fans who have not the background in the language will not know what some common untranslated words mean, and in this case, professionally published works should be obliged to have an explanatory page where they define all of their untranslated terms and honorifics.
Fan works are exempt because - honestly, do you really want to download that extra 260kb page every chapter just to have "san" and "chan" and "kun" explained to you every time? Moreover, expecting scanlations to match the quality of officially published translated manga is unrealistic - firstly, most translators are still students, not professionally accredited translators, and secondly, a lot of the time it's a balance of speed and quality.
Besides, fan translations always get a thumbs up from me for their gameness in translating swear words exactly as they should be =P
In all, it's all up to the translator - whether professional or fan - to make their own discretion about what they consider "untranslateable". Anything that is translated will lose some of its meaning, but that's the compromise one has to make. Everything should be translated if possible and practical.
Gah, I'm just annoyed at the lack of sensitbility in the rant. Has the guy ever ever worked on a scanlation/fansubbing team ever?! All translators take liberty with their own interpretations, there's no standard, just preferences.
As a (not very reliable) translator myself, I object to the complaints forwarded by the ranter.
The fact that fan tranlations are done in the first place to serve demands by English-speaking fans to keep up with the Japanese manga/anime progression and NOT FOR SALE OR KEEP, there is no obligation by the scanlating teams to make it in any way professional. Most translators will give the full translation of a new name or technique when it first appears. In subsequent appearances, the translator may, at their own discretion, use either the Japanese name or the English equivalent. Contrary to the claims of "language inconsistency" (i.e. not staying fully within English), there is a very practical reason for sticking with the Japanese name. Particularly with martial arts technique names, the English translations is often far longer than the Asian equivalent. Due to the language differences, the Asian equivalent is also immensely more poetic and descriptive - in Asian languages, the noun can often be substituted as a descriptor. Ice-flower-jade-lotus-soul-losing-mist (just as an example) sounds profoundly deranged in English, but actually makes sense in kanji. Similarly, translating Bleach terminlogy "fukutaichou" as "vice captain" rather than the immensely more cumbersome "assistant division commander" not only makes life easier for the editors trying to fit it into the speech bubbles (or on the screen for anime), but also for readers, who won't have to trip over titles ten words long.
Translating stuff isn't just about taking the most accurate and literal translation possible. That's what Babelfish does. Aside from considering the context, there's a need to consider what makes it most accessible and comprehensible for the readers. Stuffing the sentences full of untranslated Japanese names is not the way to go, but neither is giving a literal translation of every single Japanese word if it's going to disrupt the flow of the reading.
Moving onto honorifics, I've always been one for leaving honorifics untranslated, whether I'm translating from Chinese or Japanese. There is no equivalent for "kun" or "chan", and often not even "sama". Take "sama" for example, people refer to anyone they idolise or respect greatly as "sama" regardless of their real social status; in certain (rarer) situations, people also refer to their parents as "otou-sama" and "okaa-sama" or "chichi-ue" and "haha-ue", and using stuff like "Lord Dad" sounds less respectful than ridiculous. The honorifics of "san" and "kun" and "chan" are important in indicating the degree of familiarity. Since neither "kun" nor "chan" has an English equivalent, some translators choose to leave it off, but I feel that loses the integrity of the story - because it's these references that allow readers to discern the relationships between characters, as well as the personalities of the characters. A boy who refers to a girl he just met by first name + "chan" is most likely easy-going and playful, possibly flirtatious; whereas another boy who has known the same girl for a long time and still refers to her by last name + "san" is likely to be one who adheres to rules of courtesy or prefers to remain a distance. There is also a practice of dropping the use of "san" between students - because translating to "Mr" and "Miss" is just weird in a primary school setting - but again, the integrity is lost, because in Japanese the removal of the honorific means either familiarity or immense antagonism.
If I had to choose between a translation that translated all the "san" to "Mr/Mrs/Miss" and the "sama" to "Lord" and the "kun" and "chan" dropped, and another that left them untouched, I would without hesitation go for the latter.
I'm not sure what the ranter's standards of professionality is, anyway, as "professional" (published) translators of foreign languages are allowed a certain leeway with their material. There are several different translations of Tales of Genji: written in its old-Japanese form, it did not refer to anyone by name, but rather by their association or their rank. This was an arduous reading task for any culture not used to things written in this form, and some translators took the liberty of changing the implicit references to explicit names, while others left them intact. Does this make either of them less professional? No. They just have a different interpretation of the material - some valuing accuracy above practicality and vice versa. It is exactly the same in the fan circles.
The only valid complaint is that new fans who have not the background in the language will not know what some common untranslated words mean, and in this case, professionally published works should be obliged to have an explanatory page where they define all of their untranslated terms and honorifics.
Fan works are exempt because - honestly, do you really want to download that extra 260kb page every chapter just to have "san" and "chan" and "kun" explained to you every time? Moreover, expecting scanlations to match the quality of officially published translated manga is unrealistic - firstly, most translators are still students, not professionally accredited translators, and secondly, a lot of the time it's a balance of speed and quality.
Besides, fan translations always get a thumbs up from me for their gameness in translating swear words exactly as they should be =P
In all, it's all up to the translator - whether professional or fan - to make their own discretion about what they consider "untranslateable". Anything that is translated will lose some of its meaning, but that's the compromise one has to make. Everything should be translated if possible and practical.
Gah, I'm just annoyed at the lack of sensitbility in the rant. Has the guy ever ever worked on a scanlation/fansubbing team ever?! All translators take liberty with their own interpretations, there's no standard, just preferences.
